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Conferences Ramsey evidence Topic #94
Reading Topic #94
unregistered user
Apr-12-03, 11:34 AM (EST)
"Dirty Harry Revisited"
   LAST EDITED ON Apr-12-03 AT 12:05 PM (EST)
Below are posts I've saved from a couple years ago....I edited out some of it....follow the action in Dirty Harry and compare to the ransom note:

Dirty Harry""
Posted by Maikai on Feb-02-00 at 01:15 AM (EST)

I rented this again, since I don't remember much from the last time I saw it several months ago. I'm convinced the killer either taped the movie or rented or bought the video, and watched it over and over...stopping in pertinent places, and taking notes. There's a lot more of this in the ransom note, IMO, then any of the other movies.
I hope some of you watch it and post your comments.

1 . "Ransom Note"
Posted by Maikai on Feb-02-00 at 01:23 AM (EST)

It starts out with a psychopathic killer, that's been killing people. The lastest is a girl in a bathing suit swimming in a rooftop swimming pool. She is shot by the psycho from another rooftop. Dirty Harry (Clint Eastwood), comes on the scene and finds the bullet casing. There is also a note posted nearby that reads:
"To the City of San Francisco"

I will enjoy killing one person everyday until you pay me the one hundred thousand dollars ($l00,000).

If you agree say so tomorrow morning in (word crossed off) Personal column San Francisco Chronicle and I will set up meeting. If I do not hear from you it will be my next pleasure to kill a catholic priest of a nigger.

Note: The camera shows a closeup when the note is showed on a screen in police headquarters.

Certain words are IDENTICAL to those in the ransom note. ie: you (same strokes); not.
The g, with that curl on the bottom is the same, y, h, e and r are the same. I didn't notice it at first until I stopped it with pause, and then compared it to the ransom note.

The psycho kidnaps a l4 year old girl. She apparently was placed put underground, where the air will run out at a certain time. He sends her bra, and a tooth he pulled out with a pliers. He ups the ransom to $200,000, in used l0's and 20's and wants them delivered in a yellow bag.
The Mayor wants to pay the ransom. Dirty Harry says, "you know she's dead, don't you?"

Mayor tell Harry they will pay the money, so Harry is fitted with a wire. He goes to the appointed phone booth.

Psycho says "I bounce you all over town to make sure you're alone. Make sure. If I even think you're being followed, the girl dies. If you talk to anyone...I don't care if it's a pekinese pissing against a lamppost the girl dies."

Harry: "Is she ok?"

Psycho: "Just shutup and listen. No car. I give you a certain amount of time to go from phone booth to phone booth. If the phone rings four times she dies."

You listen. I am watching you---not all the time, but you won't know when or where. Now--get to Forest Hill Station as fast as you can. "

Harry: Yeah.

Psycho: I hope you're not stupid.

Harry runs around answering phones, and follows instructions.

Another call:

Psycho: Yeah. It sounds like you had a good rest---you'll need it. I'm going to give you a nice little run this time---you better make--bercause if you don't---dead girl.

(A Jesus Saves neon sign is prominent during this scene)

The final call the psycho tells Harry to go to the cross. It is a big cement cross at the entrance to a tunnel. It looks around 50 feet high--it is VERY big, and prominent throughout the scene.
Psycho confronts Dirty Harry.

Psycho: "One wrong move---anything--I'll kill you and the girl both. Understand?"

There's more conversation..psycho gives orders, tells him to drop gun, etc. then tells him to turn
and face the cross, and to put his face right up against the cross. Camera closes in on Harry looking way up the cross.

Psycho, in read ski mask, starts kicking Harry--and tells him he better not pass out yet.

Psycho: "I changed my mind. I'm going to let her die---I just wanted you to know that---understand? I just wanted to make sure yo uknew that before I killed you.

Callahan has a hidden knife and stabs psycho in leg. His partner comes to help out and starts shooting--psycho gets away.

Callahan gets reamed by his superior, and says the mayor wants to know "why we screwed everything up?"
Callahan traces the psycho to the doctor that treated him in the ER room. Doctor had recognized him as a guy that sells programs, and lives at the stadium nearby. The groundskeeper lets him live in a backroom. Callahan corners him on the field, and asks "where's the girl?" Turns out Callahan was right--psycho had killed her, and they take her body out of some kind of hole.

Callahan is at the DA's office, wanting to charge the psycho. DA is mad---telling him he had no right to assault the psycho....no right to confiscate his gun without a search warrant. DA says he will walk, and he will not spend l/2Million dollars of taxpayers money on a trial they can't win. The problem is we don't have the evidence.

Callahan says, "what the hell's that?"(meaning the rifle in the office that matches the bullets in other killings) DA repeats that the rifle means zero---it will be inadmissible. Judge comes in and confirms that and says Constitutional Rights were violated, and the search was illegal without hte search warrant. Everything will be excluded. Can't convict psycho of anything, and most likely his 4th, 5th, 6th, and l4th Amendment Rights were violated.

Dirty Harry says he will kill again---he likes it, and storms out.

Harry starts following the psycho around---sees him ogling kids on a schoolground...follows him around to sleazy stripper bars. The psycho gets paranoid, and sick of Harry following him. So psycho pays to have himself beat up, and he ends up in the hospital. He also calls the media, and they come out in full force. Psycho says the San Francisco Police did it to him---and names Harry Callahan. Psycho says the police were trying to nail him for crimes he didn't commit.

Dirty Harry gets yelled at by the commander, and the commander tells him. "Let's get one thing straight---NO SURVEILLENCE--I don't want anymore."

Psycho hijacks a schoolbus....he has sent another note to the mayor's office, (delivered at 8:00 AM) which says:
To The City Of San Francisco

"You have double-crossed me for the last time--I'm warning you to have my $200,000 and a jet airplane ready and waiting. I'll call the mayor's office at one o'clock and tell you about the hostages who I will be happy to kill."

(I wonder why the amount was so low? He could have gotten a lot more!)
Psycho calls, and tells the mayor he has 7 kids, blah blah...Notable...he says "Now listen---listen very carefully."

Harry ends up saving the day.....jumps on the bus as it's travelling down an expressway...get it to stop, and there's a chase scene. He ends up killing the psycho. Harry throws his badge in after him.

In between, there were scenes where Harry saved the day by stopping a suicide....single-handedly catching and shooting bank robbers, and his clothes barely get mussed. He reminded me of Steve Thomas.

There's a lot of parallel themes in this movie and the JBR murder. Several phrases almost verbatim. I don't see how the JBR ransom note could have been written cold---it had to be written out beforehand, IMO----and practiced and recopied....possibly down to some of the same characters/words in the first ransom note in Dirty Harry. I think the killer watched certain movies over and over.

I wonder if classified ads were checked on the 26th, and "if" JR hadn't called police, if there was more to the plan. I wonder if making the police look stupid wasn't part of it. I wonder if someone wanted to be a hero, that may have somehow been connected to the investigation---or via the media. OJ was an example of many people that made money and had careers enhanced due to the media coverage.

8 . "Striking parallels"
Posted by MaskedMan on Feb-02-00 at 02:16 AM (EST)

Again, you've done some good work.
There seem to be parallels between Dirty Harry and the ransom note. The warning not to talk to a dog is in the movie and in the note. The repetition of the phrase "the girl dies" seems like "she dies" in the note. In both, there is a reference to being "rested" and being run around town by the kidnapper.
The ransom note in the Ramsey case doesn't strike me as genuine. The note is too melodramatic and histrionic to be real. It seems to be written for effect, not for ransom. The note tries to strike a pose in every sentence. The ending, "Victory S.B.T.C," is just more pretense. Since there was no abduction, I assume that the note wasn't part of a real kidnapping attempt.

The note could have been partially derived from the movies Dirty Harry and Speed. The line "Don't try to grow a brain" was lifted right out of Speed. How could Patsy have recalled appropriate movie lines to plug into the note? It seems like someone had watched these kidnap/ransom movies recently. It's as if someone even consulted these movies for ideas about how to stage a kidnapping.

10 . "MM...not just the note, "
Posted by Maikai on Feb-02-00 at 02:40 AM (EST)

but some of the themes struck me this time when I watched it: the police looking stupid; the DA and PD fighting; and the setup theme. The first time I was only listening for phrases.
It's almost like someone copied the script (along with some others), and the police & DA followed it. It's one thing to think up a fantasy---another entirely, to actually carry it to extremes. Unless...the fantasy was only that, and not meant to end in murder. "Possibly" one person duped into going along with it---even writing the note---the other the actual killer. Except, you'd think the writer would have some remorse---'course facing a death sentence would be a strong deterrent to keeping ones mouth shut. Wouldn't be the first time a psychopath duped someone into being an accomplice.

Then again, one person, with a murderous intent all along, getting pleasure that his script was followed by the police and DA. And, you know your town better then I----would it be all that unlikely there's a somewhat clever psychopath that managed to blend in? The capitalization of the letters in references to authority figures in the ransom note could have been deliberate--with the killer purposely using capitals, but resented authority.

11 . "Giant Leap....."
Posted by Maikai on Feb-03-00 at 00:52 AM (EST)

Regardless of why the ransom note followed the Dirty Harry/Ransom theme, and the motive for the murder, the question I haven't heard ANY of the BORG answer is.....how did either of the Ramsey's acquire the knowledge of the movies? To the point where specific phrases interspersed throughout the movie were quoted almost verbatim?
It's one thing to argue they had opportunity....another to argue where the knowledge of the movies--not to mention the elaborate staging came from? The ransom note speaks for itself and it is full of movie references/themes---even if it were done as someone else's staging to disguise the true motive. That cannot be disputed.

Was there a copy of Dirty Harry in the Ramsey video collection? Were they so calm, cool, and collected after the "accidental" murder of their cherished daughter---that either of them could sit down and spend hours watching the film to pull out the pertinent phrases---and then compile a logical-sounding note?

PMPT listed l7 reasons the BPD used in presenting the case to the DA.....many of which were entirely circumstantial to weave a web. You can bet if even a copy of "Dirty Harry" or "Speed" were found in the home that it would have been listed as another "gotcha." That did not occur--and nothing during the leaky phase was released that either parent had any knowledge of the films. Nothing has ever been released publicly as to how they could have obtained this knowledge.

12 . "Thanks, Maikai"
Posted by SpiritRain on Feb-03-00 at 06:56 AM (EST)

Excellent thread. I saw Dirty Harry about the time I started the forum. I could help but notice the similarities. I thought we had discussed the SBTC connection on one of the SBTC threads.
But as you mentioned in the above post, how could anyone suspect Patsy of writing this note? Certainly if she had been watching Dirty Harry non stop for hours and hours...freezing certain scenes, someone would have noticed. Also if she had watched Dirty Harry, or Speed, or any of the other movies we've discussed, would there have been Christmas at the Ramsey house? How would Patsy have the time to do all she did for her family and community and watch those movies to write a 3 page ransom note?

I think common sense would tell anyone that it was impossible for Patsy to have written the note.

13 . "SpiritRain......"
Posted by Maikai on Feb-03-00 at 07:26 AM (EST)

How many of the movie lines would you have been able to sit down and write after you saw the movie? No doubt many have better retention then I----but there's very few movies I've seen where I can recall much later on exact wording. Even after viewing the 3 Godfather tapes several times, the only line I can recall is "keep your friends close--but your enemies even closer."
I challenge any BORG lurking or on this forum, to come up with a plausible explaination on how either of the Ramsey's had the intimate knowledge of the movie lines/themes, and also, to offer an explanation of why no one--not Linda Pugh; nor the scads of other people interviewed; ever said either of the Ramseys were drawn to these kinds of films.

16 . "Maikai..."
Posted by Seal on Feb-03-00 at 09:32 AM (EST)

very interesting thread...you have done a great job finding all those quotes in Dirty Harry, and showing the difference of opinions between the law agencies. There is no doubt in my mind that whoever killed JonBenet was a crime cultist...someone who absorbed these movies to the max, memorized lines that they probably sometimes quoted to others...and, IMO, this habit is a big clue to the killer's identity.
I have always agreed that neither Patsy nor John could have sat down after that horrendous crime, and casually penned that note, remembering all those lines from Dirty Harry and Speed. If this was penned before the murder, as I think it was, it would prove this murder was premeditated. There was not an accident that was covered up...JonBenet was murdered intentionally the way I see it. The parents could not have murdered their child intentionally...they were too crazy about that little girl to have even thought about that.

17 . "Unemployed?"
Posted by Maikai on Feb-03-00 at 09:32 AM (EST)

Maybe.....and also needed money. 'Course, I'm employed, and find time for a lot of different things.
Question in my mind is......if someone did their homework on developing the note---what was the motive all along? Still smacks to me---kidnapping, for $$$.

If a homicidal pedophile---why the note? He'd know an autopsy would reveal the sexual assault.

One person, inexperiened in kidnapping and murder, IMO, fits the profile, and one person may have had a problem controlling JBR. And what type would be into movies...stun guns...bondage...breaking and entering...hi-tec hiking boots...resentful of fat cats?

18 . "I agree Maikai"
Posted by Afton on Feb-03-00 at 11:39 AM (EST)

LAST EDITED ON Feb-03-00 AT 11:39 AM (EST)
I believe it was kidnapping for $$ and the ransom note was written as a thrill to see the police scramble as in the L & L theory.

As to what the anti rams would say about the Ramsey memorizing the movie one liners--I heard one say in past posts that it is easy to do and they could do it and then go on to quote the one liners chapter and verse.

19 . "not quoting line for line"
Posted by LovelyPigeon on Feb-03-00 at 12:05 PM (EST)

but I think I could write a similar note. I've seen all those movies, and although the particulars don't stick with me, the generalities do. The line *don't try and grow a brain* sticks with me at least in part because it became part of the teen jargon in the school where I worked after Speed played in theatres.
Ransom was playing in theatres in December '96, and there are a lot of similar scenes in it too...kidnapping child,short piece of duct tape on mouth, calling with orders not to contact authorities, a complicated delivery scheme with lots of phone calls, warnings of killing if instructions not followed, high tech surveillance,etc.

If I were asked to write a ransom note (as some sort of school assignment maybe) I think I'd come up with a similar one, not with direct quotes, but with the same themes.

I don't think anyone thought there was a "small foreign faction" behind the ransom note...no matter if it was an earnest attempt to gain $$$ or just a ruse to throw off police from the writer's identity.

20 . "Maikai and MM"
Posted by mBm on Feb-03-00 at 12:31 PM (EST)

In regard to the capitalization of certain letters, since I worked for a local police department, I always capitalized letters pertinent to the "organization chart." Thus, it was Police Department, Executive Department, Parks Department, City of Metropolis, etc. However, others, including the local newspapers would always use police department, parks department, city of Metropolis, etc. So the note writer could possibly have been associated with an agency or establishment that used capitalization similarly. From a college, law-enforcement agency, etc.?
Also, since Janet McR was a drama critic for the newspaper, I would really like to know if she reviewed any of these movies and if so, what was her take on them? MM, do you have access to any of her critiques? If you can refer back to them, it would certainly be interesting reading, IMO.

23 . "Interesting "
Posted by Southern_Belle on Feb-03-00 at 02:43 PM (EST)

This thread has changed my mind about the perp being immature. I thought the terms used were silly, now I know why, they came from the movies!
So, the perp might be very mature, intelligent, but remembered these phrases to add for confusion. After realizing this I see the perp was indeed above average in intelligence. He/she knew how to throw the PD off not only with certain terms, words, but with immature ramblings.

Thanks for this thread, it has changed some of my views.

22 . "mBm"
Posted by MaskedMan on Feb-03-00 at 01:24 PM (EST)

I have a very hard time suspecting Janet McReynolds, odd though she is. I can't see any motive for her. Her husband, Bill, who seems harmless to me, has such a big bushy beard that I would think he would have shed a white hair somewhere at the crime scene, especially after all the activity in this crime. I just can't buy it.
By the time the movie Speed came out, Janet was no longer a movie reviewer. I don't know if she reviewed Dirty Harry. That would take some digging.
25 . "SBTC"
Posted by MaskedMan on Feb-03-00 at 04:39 PM (EST)

I seriously doubt that "SBTC" stands for "Saved by the Cross." That's just a wild guess. As far as I know (and I checked into it), there is no standard phrase or cliche such as "saved by the cross" in Christianity.
No one knows what SBTC means. It may mean nothing. There's no way to know for sure, so it's a waste of time trying to figure it out. I think SBTC is probably just random letters designed to create confusion. It's like the "small foreign faction": nonsense.
26 . "Maikai"
Posted by jams on Feb-03-00 at 05:01 PM (EST)

Once again you show yourself to be an excellent sleuth - someone willing to put some effort into the search.
I would love to see the note in the movie posted so we could compare it. Will have to watch the movie to look, but I can't transfer it to the computer - if anyone can that would be real nice.

I do feel like the killer watched these movies a lot - he imagined the thrill of the kill and being the center of attention. I just think he had NO idea now bad the cops would bungle it. God, to think how he must be watching these movies even now and comparing notes.

I think it is a fair guess that he is still watching these movies. JMO - but i would hope if he IS, someone is noticing...

27 . "MM"
Posted by jimb on Feb-03-00 at 05:26 PM (EST)

>>No one knows what SBTC means. It may mean nothing.
You may well be correct in that we will never know for certain what it means. But i do think it means something.

There are too many coincidences here. If the note mentioned an amount other than the 118K net bonus amount, or had something other than SBTC, I would be more inclined to ignore them as merely extraneous. But what are the probabilities that someone randomly picks BOTH the net bonus, and the initials on a picture on 3rd floor and/or on plaque in basement? This would be really coincidental.

I don't believe the writer was someone close to the family, but I do believe the writer knew something of the family. At least John Ramsey's first name. The writer may not have known, or remembered precisely, the name of the company.

Except for stuff like senseless drive-by shootings, rarely do murderers pick their victims purely at random. I believe the killer began to focus in on the R's sometime in the month prior to the murder. And the choice of victim may not have occurred all at once.

Also, I think it quite possible the killer was on the 3rd floor at some time or other. This seems like a more likely spot to see the SBTC on the aircraft-carrier picture, than on the plaque stashed away in the basement. We have no good explanation for the newspaper photo on the 3rd floor that has the X's on business people except for the heart on JR. Perhaps JBR did draw this, but apparently JR never saw it, nor Burke, PR, or LHP.

28 . "Meaningless letters"
Posted by MaskedMan on Feb-03-00 at 08:12 PM (EST)

One reason I think that SBTC must be meaningless is that the writer of the note wouldn't have put in any clues that could be decoded to help solve the crime.
The writer was trying to create a diversion, for instance by blaming a "small foreign faction." Everything in the note is a ruse, including "S.B.T.C." The writer wanted to mislead, not leave hints.
30 . "SBTC?"
Posted by Maikai on Feb-03-00 at 10:43 PM (EST)

Who knows? There was a religious theme---before the l4 year old girl was kidnapped, the killer's next victim was going to be a priest. He was setup, and Dirty Harry spotted him on a rooftop. A large vertical neon sign, with the words "Jesus Saves" was prominent. There was a shootout, and the killer got away. He shot out some of the letters on the sign, while laughing...before he escaped.
The scene at the cross was one of the more dramatic scenes in the movie. The killer was never named in the movie---called "killer" in the credits. No attempt was made to explain why he did what he did, except Dirty Harry's comment that he liked to kill.

The killer taunted Dirty Harry and the police--it was a big game for him. He was portrayed as a nice-looking, white, twenty-something male that could be very charming, and in a flash become this demented killer that liked to hurt people. He knew about evidence---knew his rights.

34 . "MM"
Posted by jimb on Feb-04-00 at 03:19 AM (EST)

One reason I think that SBTC must be meaningless is that the writer of the note wouldn't have put in any clues that could be decoded to help solve the crime.
<< (emphasis mine).
In a prior post of yours you pointed out, cogently IMO, that the note viewed as a whole is directed toward convincing a reader that a 'small foreign faction' is involved. Structurally, the note opens with who they are, and ends with their signature. I agree with your reasoning.

But you can sign with any number of signatures or acronyms. Why not 'AZTC', or 'LATZ", or 'etc...'? Anything. My post was directed at not just one coincidence, 'SBTC', but at two coincidences, i.e. 118K. It is the conjunction of the two that suggests to me that neither the ransom amount nor the signature was random. That is why i do not think either the ransom amount or the signature was meaningless. And, IMO, it is why the note provides a clue, however faint, to the killer's identity.

You raise a good point -- why put in a clue. I don't know. But, I also believe not all killers are entirely rational (if any are). So why assume that this particular killer is entirely rational? I think we have to drop most assumptions here. As Lee said, this one isn't easy.

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Dirty Harry Revisited [View All], Maikai , 11:34 AM, Apr-12-03, (0)  
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unregistered user
Apr-12-03, 11:43 AM (EST)
1. "Old Review of Dirty Harry"
In response to message #0
   (this was a signficant film)

36 . "Dirt Harry Online"
Posted by SpiritRain on Feb-04-00 at 08:38 AM (EST)

Visit this website. Real audio/video and movie synopsis:

37 . "Thanks Spirtrain..."
Posted by Maikai on Feb-04-00 at 09:11 AM (EST)

Good find! Here's the writeup from the website. Note comment at the end that the Phillipine police used it as a training film...also interesting comments about Dirty Harry and authority and he was a loner:
Detective Harry Callahan. You don't assign him
to murder cases. You just turn him loose."

The movie opens with a sniper shooting a girl in a San Francisco rooftop swimming pool; assigned to the case is Detective Harry Callahan. He is
called to the office of the mayor, who has received a demand for $100,000 from the killer, calling himself Scorpio, or he will kill another. From the start we see that Callahan has a problem with authority, as the mayor calls into question his unorthodox methods. A decision is made to try to gain time by placing a notice to the killer
in the paper, while at the same time mounting helicopter surveillance and rooftop vigils. Meanwhile we get a glimpse of Harry's methods - and his outsize .44 Magnum - when he foils a bank robbery (the famous "Do I feel lucky?" scene).
Harry is commended for his handling of the incident, but is then grudgingly landed with a new partner for the Scorpio case, Chico - a Mexican sociology graduate. Meanwhile Scorpio has been spotted from a helicopter, but escapes, and Harry and Chico cruise the streets that evening looking for him. They see someone who matches the description and follow him, but he is not the man - and Harry gets comically mistaken for a peeping Tom. They are then called to another location,
where it turns out the man in question is actually a jumper on top of a building. Harry gets on the crane-lift, distracts the man and, after a
struggle way above the ground, brings him down to safety - he tells Chico he is called Dirty Harry because he gets all the dirty jobs.

Next day, a 10-year old black kid has been shot by Scorpio, and that evening a rooftop shootout between Harry and Scorpio ensues - but the
latter escapes again. He then kidnaps a 14-year-old girl, rapes her and buries her alive, demanding $200,000 for her whereabouts. Harry is sent with the money and is run around the city from phone to phone by Scorpio, and when they meet in a park Harry is beaten up, and Chico - who has been tailing them - gets shot (but not fatally). Harry however stabs Scorpio in the leg with a stiletto, and is able to trace him through a hospital to the deserted Kezar Stadium - where he beats the girl's whereabouts out of Scorpio. She is already dead though, and Scorpio walks away because his rights have been violated.

Now Scorpio hires a thug to beat him up, so he can lodge a brutality case against Harry (who says it's obvious he didn't do it - because "he
looks too damn good"). Scorpio meanwhile has robbed a liquor store and obtained a gun, and goes out and hijacks a school bus, demanding the
money and a plane. Harry refuses to be the mayor's "delivery boy"; instead he goes to the bus's route and leaps onto its roof from a trestle bridge. After a high speed drive while Scorpio tries to shake him off, they end up in a quarry, where Harry chases Scorpio, exchanging shots all the time. Eventually Scorpio grabs a boy who is fishing and holds him as a shield, but Harry shoots him in the shoulder, leading to a reprise of the "Do I feel lucky?" scene - this time delivered with venom. Scorpio takes his chance, and is gunned down by Harry, who disgustedly throws his badge into the river.

This is the film which finally secured Clint Eastwood's position as a major force in American cinema. It was highly controversial on its
release - the ever-hostile Pauline Kael described the film as "fascist", but many other more reasonable critics also criticized its politics for excusing police brutality. In the era following the noted Miranda and Escobedo cases, this was something which was high in the public's
consciousness. But the film is unjustly criticized for this: in essence it is the story of a basically good cop who get more and more frustrated with the red tape and bureaucracy by which he is bound. When a girl is buried alive
and dying, the foremost idea in his mind is - quite reasonably - to use any means at his disposal to save her life. Similarly, we can see that in the normal line of duty, he is just an ordinary cop who does his job without getting involved emotionally - note the light-hearted smile which plays across his face as he addresses the wounded bank robber, and
demonstrates that his gun is, in fact, empty. There is an impression almost of respect for the good, "honest" hoods, with whom the police deal on a regular basis - but when a psychopath such as Scorpio appears, the difference is clear. Callahan takes the case almost personally, and we can see his changed point of view from the different way he delivers top Scorpio the same speech as he gave the bank robber. He is disgusted with this sort of criminal, and it is this that makes him throw away his badge.

All the time, we build up a very clear picture of Harry Callahan's character. Some of it is obvious, such as his arguments with his superiors, but there are other points that show the same thing - for instance, when told by the mayor to take a seat he does not take the one between his two superior officers, but instead sits over by the wall. He is a lonely man, and his job is all he has: his wife was killed by a drunk driver (although this is not dwelled upon); he eats lunch and dinner in the same diner every day; and he always wears the same shabby clothes. Despite the "final" note on which the film ends, he is a
character who would serve Clint well over the years - and despite the critics' scorn of the film, the movie-going public could identify with
this man, and made the film his highest-grossing to date.

•The part was turned down by John Wayne and Paul Newman. Frank Sinatra had to pull out because of a hand injury. The story was originally called as "Dead Right" Scorpio was based on real life killer "Zodiac", who operated in San Francisco in the late 60s but was never caught. A copycat killer in 1974 prompted the graffiti "Dirty Harry, where are you now that we need you?"

When Siegel fell ill with flu, Eastwood stepped in to direct the suicide rescue scene, wanting it to have the documentary feel of news footage he had seen. Scheduled to be shot over six nights, it was in the can after just one. The jumper was played by Buddy Van Horn The cinema behind Harry when he foils the bank robbery is showing Play Misty for Me. This scene is the only one to be shot on the back lot.As usual, Clint did most of his own stunts, including the leap from the bridge onto the roof of the bus . When Scorpio hits the shopkeeper with a bottle, there is no liquid in
it. Believe it or not, a section of the Philippine police force ordered a print of the movie - for use as a training film!

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unregistered user
Apr-13-03, 05:11 PM (EST)
2. "RE: Old Review of Dirty Harry"
In response to message #1
   Right Maikai,
As stated on many other lines, there is no question of the crime movie involvement in this mystery. Dirty Harry seems to be the most directly related with almost word for word script in the movie. After learning about the research Braveheart had done on the movie connection, I carefully studied all the mentioned movies (except for Speed) for even the most subtle of hints. Here are some of my further thoughts:

Dirty Harry was saved by (next to) the cross (by his partner taking shot at the culprit) and by Dirty Harry himself concealing and then using his knife on the culprit. Ironically, the culprit squealed like a Pig. Motive?: the culprit had a vengeance on society and the Pigs. Theme?: People like Dirty Harry got the dirty work and those in power could sacrifice (crucify) people like Dirty Harry, but in the end, Dirty Harry had victory, only to throw his badge away. Point to the movie?: dirty work has got to be done. You can not pay the ransom or try to reason with scum.

Most if not all crime movies have a cop in them. So maybe it is not surprising that there a variety of cop personnas:
Dirty Harry - dirty work cop
Ransom - bad cop
Speed - ? I saw along time ago and have not reviewed with JBR
Seven - frustrated nieve cop?
Nick of Time - phony cop
Ricochet - super too good to be true cop

Sure there is money involved in ransoms, but money is power. The perp is probably trying to tell us the motive for killing JonBenet:
Dirty Harry - revenge on powers that be (mayor and cops) and also against a cop who foils the culprit's ambitions
Ransom - revenge on small cop's wage, but more so later on against a super business dad who foils the culprit's ambitions
Speed - ?
Seven - revenge on hypocracy of society and the power of a cop
Nick of Time - revenge and envy against a governor who foils the faction's ambitions
Ricochet - revenge and envy against a cop who foils the culprit's ambitions
Leopold and Loeb (and the movie: Rope) - show how smart and powerful they are

Someone (likely one, but perhaps two) who wanted to show how smart they were and wanted to really get revenge on John Ramsay. Just like in Ricochet (redirecting fate and revenge), JonBenet carried the Heart in her hand that belonged to John Ramsay. Just like in Ricochet, a Heart was drawn around John Ramsay on the business magazine. The perp wanted John Ramsay to live and go through hell (through his daughter's death). The ransom note was a lie from the start, so maybe the perp really had a business problem with John Ramsay. Why would the perp say they respect John's "bussiness" and later say that the two gentlemen watching over his daughter did not particularly like John very much. Just like in Ricochet, the perp was in reality taunting John Ramsay. I keep coming to the conclusion that the perp had a falling out in business with John Ramsay and while John's career soared, the perp's fell. Perhaps the business problem might be related to the Small Business Technical Coalition (SBTC www.sbtc.org ) and the perp's failure in winning a grant (many of which are around the $100k to $200k range. I recall on some of my Internet research that there was some SBIR (related to SBTC) real estate business inolving downtown Boulder and further out. It might be that John Ramsay was supposed to do something and in failing, the perp felt betrayed, losing out on the benefits of a grant and then decided to get revenge through the death of John's daughter.

I understand that Steve Thomas was frustrated with the DA for not getting the phone records. Perhaps he was alluding to the possibility that phone calls were made during the middle of the night to some kind of advisors on how to clean a crime scene (and how to write a phony ransom note). However, it just seems too implausible that with so much emotional turmoil, one could direct the parents over the phone to choreograph the ransom note, the business magazine, the suitcase in the Train Room and basement scene complete with the heart drawn in JonBenet's little hand, not to mention the other previous oddities in Charlevoix. Chances are much greater that a perp driven by hate, envy and revenge (most likely related to business) prepared this while the family was out for dinner and later slept. For what it's worth, I suggest the DA check out any past SBTC business relations with John Ramsay. The Heart drawn over John Ramsay on the business magazine and the Heart drawn in the little hand of JonBenet makes this crime appear to be more personal than just that of a idiot vagrant.

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unregistered user
Apr-14-03, 01:40 AM (EST)
3. "Thank you Terrance"
In response to message #2
   LAST EDITED ON Apr-14-03 AT 01:46 AM (EST)
for your summary of all the movies. Do you think it's possible this perp predicted how the BPD would act, and that the Ramseys would end up being suspects, even with a handwritten note? (ie: Ricochet)

I think the entreprenaur article, if brought in by the perp is a key piece of evidence as to his motive...since it so closely resembles "Ricochet." And it would show premeditation...and a long, simmering hatred.

SBTC then could very likely be the technology group.....lots of little clues in the note...and IMO, could indicate someone connected to Access or the computer field, or linked to them in someway---ie: respecting the business, but I don't like YOU.

It shows someone that had the brains, time, and motive to weave movie themes together to compose the ransom "letter." Boulder was the perfect environment where some psycho that got an idea could pull off this crime, and blend in, IMO. It does appear to be more than some creep that watched "Ransom" decided to make some quick money. It could be he wrote his own movie script---I don't know how he could be sure the police would go off in the direction they did---that would have exceeded his wildest dreams, IMO. On the other hand, I was with a relative that had gone to school in Boulder, the night they found JBR's body, and the first thing out of his mouth was, "the BPD will screw it up." I asked why he would say that, and he said their expertise was writing tickets for walking around with a six-pack, or drunk. So....that may have been common knowledge---that Boulder just didn't have a lot of major crimes such as homicides or kidnappings. Duping the police could have been part of it.

In "Speed", the psycho guy was a former law enforcement type, that worked in the explosives area. I think he made a reference to just getting a lousy gold watch when he retired? Not sure...but that comes to mind. He was pissed with Keneau foiled his attempt at getting ransom by threatening to blow up the elevator. He felt unrewarded in his career, and he was going to make up for it. So....his next attempt was the bus.

The movie references could have been in his mind for a long time---certain ones stuck with him. Deliberately picking Christmas would have been significant. "Dirty Harry" was made in the 70's---a pretty old movie, but significant in movieland--it might have all the elements the perp identified with. I don't know how someone could have hidden the resentment for a long period of time---unless he was the classic loner sociopath. The success of Access that Christmas may have driven him into action.

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Apr-14-03, 01:54 AM (EST)
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4. "In "Seven", Kevin Spacey"
In response to message #3
   said what he did would be talked about for a long time. Since it was based on the seven deadly sins, Spacey said cutting off the detective's wife's head was his sin...envy. He was envious of the life that the detective had---he knew he was young and reactive----and would shoot him (Spacey). "Proper burial" is referenced in that movie.

I don't think they ever revealed who Spacey was, or where he came from---there were no records leading to him---including his fingerprints, because he had filed the padded parts of his fingertips.

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unregistered user
Apr-14-03, 12:15 PM (EST)
5. "RE: Ricochet Movie"
In response to message #4
   Maikai, you wrote:
"Do you think it's possible this perp predicted how the BPD would act, and that the Ramseys would end up being suspects, even with a handwritten note? (ie: Ricochet)"

Definitely. In Ricochet, the culprit cleverly predicted how the DA and the community would react and since it is so clear that the JonBenet perp included the Ricochet reference, I am very sure that the perp was intending to set-up John Ramsay in the same way. As to how well the perp could predict the BPD depends on how close or knowledgeable the perp was of the BPD. (Saying that stirs up some other speculation: in both Ricochet and Dirty Harry there was antagonism between the cop and the DA as well as the cop and the culprit. However, I treat that with very light speculation.)

"I think the entreprenaur article, if brought in by the perp is a key piece of evidence as to his motive...since it so closely resembles "Ricochet." And it would show premeditation...and a long, simmering hatred.

SBTC then could very likely be the technology group.....lots of little clues in the note...and IMO, could indicate someone connected to Access or the computer field, or linked to them in someway---ie: respecting the business, but I don't like YOU."

Definitely. There MUST have been SERIOUS premeditation to so brutally take the life of an innocent young child. As it has been said many times, all that exposure of the Ramsay's success (business and pageant) at a critical time of the year (Christmas) was just too much for the perp. As in Ricochet, the perp's Christmas was probably low on money and without a princess of a daughter. The Ramsay's on the other hand were the talk of the town.

I am pretty sure that the motive had to do with money and success in a related business. The S.B.T.C might however refer to something else. In the Ransom note the perp referred to John's "southern common sense". That might have been a subtle, taunting and ironic hint that the perp was from the south. I think the DA should take another look at any suspects who might have come from the south and had a falling out with John Ramsay's business.

Thanks, Maikai. If people keep on picking at this mystery from different angles, just maybe someday we will see the truth.

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unregistered user
Apr-15-03, 01:48 AM (EST)
6. "What about the son of someone"
In response to message #5
   that felt slighted by JR...or was jealous of him? A lot of the elements seem to fit someone younger, that perhaps had certain advantages. (ie: bat, stun gun, hi-tec boots(not exactly cheap), the garrotte (martial arts training?) and the movie lines). There are website devoted to gameplaying and movie lines.

The animosity between the DA's office and BPD, may be not have been all that secret---anyone living in Boulder, might have heard rumors.

"Ricochet" could have been a blueprint....complete with the magazine front pages hanging on the wall.

"Southern common sense" from the note sure sounds like sarcasm to me----perhaps someone that goes way back---but it sounded more like a slam against southerners.

They should look at the obvious---the written word....and not discount the "clues" to the killer's mind. I believe that's what John Douglas did earlyon. By the time you get to the last paragraph, the killer's true voice seems to come out, with all the sarcasm, and calling John by his first name....the writer seems to get more worked up by the end.

A son of someone acquainted with the Ramseys, that perhaps had a history of petty crime, seems to fit. Would a middle-age man (or woman) really have the wherewithal and courage to enter the house?

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unregistered user
Apr-15-03, 01:50 PM (EST)
7. "RE: What about the son of someone"
In response to message #6
   Maikai, as you said in quotes:
"What about the son of someone that felt slighted by JR...or was jealous of him? A lot of the elements seem to fit someone younger, that perhaps had certain advantages."

I still think that the heart drawn on the business magazine points to someone older and involved with business. However, there is a chance that a University friend of JAR was studying Commerce and could relate to the business magazine.

""Southern common sense" from the note sure sounds like sarcasm to me----perhaps someone that goes way back---but it sounded more like a slam against southerners."

You have a point there. I still think there is also a chance that it is a possible hint of the perp's past.

"By the time you get to the last paragraph, the killer's true voice seems to come out, with all the sarcasm, and calling John by his first name....the writer seems to get more worked up by the end."

This would suggest to me that it is someone who has met John before on business and refrerred to him as "John". Not a friend but someone who crossed pathes with John's business. I don't think a younger friend of John's son would address him other than at first, "Mr.Ramsay".

"Would a middle-age man (or woman) really have the wherewithal and courage to enter the house?"

Yes, once that he decided it was the only way to relieve his ongoing anger and pain towards John. The ultimate revenge, how to spoil one's Christmas, by killing their daughter.

Here is my step by step reasoning (guided by hints left by the perp):

1. I am not a cop and I don't have the file, but from what I have read, the autopsy points more to garroting first and then the horrendous hit to the head. Chances are very great that a first hit to the head would have caused alot of blood loss. There was very little blood loss internally and the scalp skin did not break. Chances are very great that this was premiditated garroting and not just an accident.

2. As many have stated before, it would be quite a feat for either or both of the Ramsays to choreograph the Ransom Note, the heart drawn around John Ramsay in the business magaazine, the heart drawn in JonBenet's hand, and the previous Charlevoix incidents. Chances are much greater that it was a well prepared and motivated intruder.

3. It just does not seem possible that either of these parents could garrot their daughter and therefore it was an intruder. Therefore, the parents were honest about the ransom note and business magazine and the heart drawn around John Ramsay.

4. "Dirty Harry" movie references in Ransom note is the first hint primer to kidnap/murder crime movies and directs one to look further.

5. The heart drawn over John Ramsay in the business magazine (as in the movie "Ricochet")suggests that this is for revenge on business.

6. The heart drawn in the hand of JonBenet is the clincher. It is the confirmation that the perp got his/her revenge.

7. The murder happened the same night that the movie "Nick of Time" aired locally. This is too much of a coincidence. In that movie, the culprits (a man and a women) pretended to be cops, kidnapped the six year old girl and threatened the father to do their bidding (kill the governor) or the girl dies. I noted on another line that the clock struck just past 1:18 at a turning point in the movie. It might be that the perp was watching this movie at about 7:00 that evening and after comparing his/her miserable life to that of the Ramsays (made so public that month), the perp decided to put his plan into action. The perp was getting his revenge on something that John Ramsay was supposed to do.

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unregistered user
Apr-16-03, 01:21 AM (EST)
8. "Terrance, I'm rewatching"
In response to message #7
   "Ricochet". Lots of things I missed, before, but didn't take note of until your posts. The film highlights one of the first trials when Denzel Washington became a prosecutor--a trial he gained notoriety from---it involved a "Night Strangler"---a guy that killed 9 people by strangulation. The front page is highlighted several times. In one scene, Lithgow kills a guy in prison, and the newspaper frontpage is on his chest....the frontpage was on the wall in Lithgow's cell. So your comment about a premeditated and planned killing of JBR by garrotte, if it ties into the movie, could be possible.

Then there is Denzel's friend, that is found hung (murdered by Lithgow). That is the first setup. The friend is forced to write a suicide note, where he makes reference to him and Denzel being involved in child porn and molestation. Child porn magazines were planted in the friend's briefcase. Denzel doesn't believe it, but the DA says the forensic's have matched the handwriting. So...police are misled...and suspicion starts to be cast on Denzel, and the media picks up on it.

Then, shortly after the suicide, Denzel is kidnapped by Lithgow, and shot up with cocaine and heroin over several days----filmed having sex with a prostitute who has a venereal disease (to be used later). There is a scene where Lithgow hand wrestles with Denzel---and he talks about how their lives were similar. They met at the beginning of both of their careers (albeit Lithgow was into criminal activities). Lithgow's was ruined by Denzel, and Lithgow has carried the vendetta for years.

Denzel is then dumped off, and goes to a hospital where he tells his "strange" story that no one believes (except his wife, and she starts having doubts). The cocaine and heroin is found in his blood....and his life starts unravelling. Lithgow has succcessfully set him up. (didn't finish the rest, yet).

Denzel's daughters are highlighted---towards the beginning where Lithgow gets in the house, posing as someone from the electric company, that the babysitter lets in to restore the power (that Lithgow turned off). He drugs them all, and there's some weird scenes where it looks like Lithgow is going to kill the daughters---he carries them upstairs, past the pictures and magazine articles hung on he wall. Killing them would be revenge, but he doesn't kill them....when Denzel and his wife comes home, and find the babysitter stoned on the couch, and she can't remember putting the kids to bed, the parents charge up the stairs to check on them. Lots of drama and then they open the door to the bedroom---a viewer would imagine they would be dead...but are found sleeping.

As you point out, the heart on the hand of JBR..heart around JR's head on the entrepreneur article, could be the tie to the vendetta based on the movie....then you add the other clues, such as the bonus.

"Nick of Time" was shown as 7PM, right? If Lou Smit's theory is right, then he perp would have been in the house during that time---so how could that trigger the plan since he was already in the house? If it ran two hours, then that would have been close to the time the Ramseys came home. That would mean the perp watched it somewhere else, and came in after the Ramseys went to bed, wouldn't it?

I have a hard time trying to understand a long simmering vendetta...unless the resentment was there, and JR's success put him over the edge. Perhaps different scenarios fantacized.....so the idea was there in the perp's brain--he just needed a trigger to set fantasy into motion.

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unregistered user
Apr-16-03, 03:18 AM (EST)
9. "RE: Terrance, I'm rewatching"
In response to message #8
   "in one scene Lithgow kills a guy in prison, and the newspaper frontpage is on his chest....the frontpage was on the wall in Lithgow's cell."

It is very briefly shown, but never the less the heart is drawn over Denzel and an "X" on the others who were later killed. The same thing was apparently drawn on the business magazine highlighting John Ramsay. The same thing with John Ramsay except that his buddies were not killed; his daughter was. The culprit acted by Lithgow wanted to destroy Denzel's life and career by framing him. The perp who killed JonBenet wanted to destroy John Ramsay's life and career. I would say the perp succeeded. John was essentially out of a job the next day and his daughter gone.

"Lithgow's (criminal career) was ruined by Denzel, and Lithgow has carried the vendetta for years."

That is what leads me to think that the perp who killed JonBenet was harboring for some time a hatred for John Ramsay and identified with the culprit acted by Lithgow.

"there's some weird scenes where it looks like Lithgow is going to kill the daughters---he carries them upstairs, past the pictures and magazine articles hung on he wall. Killing them would be revenge, but he doesn't kill them"

In the movie Ricochet, Lithgow videotaped a threat that he could kill Denzel's daughters. The perp who killed JonBenet carried out the threat. The heart drawn in JonBenet's hand clinches it. This might also connect to the movie: Nick of Time where the daughter's life was threatened if the father did not carry out his orders. Perhaps John Ramsay did not do something he was supposed to and it caused great heartache to the perp.

"then you add the other clues, such as the bonus."

Right on. That would make a logical business connection to the odd $118,000.00 ransom. I am looking at the people still under the umbrella of business problems with John Ramsay and I know of one who comes from the South, ie. Texas.

""Nick of Time" was shown as 7PM, right? If Lou Smit's theory is right, then he perp would have been in the house during that time---so how could that trigger the plan since he was already in the house? If it ran two hours, then that would have been close to the time the Ramseys came home. That would mean the perp watched it somewhere else, and came in after the Ramseys went to bed, wouldn't it?"

Good point. He might have seen the movie before and after sitting through half an hour of it again that night, he decided to take a drive and commit himself to action.

Maybe I am reading too much into these movies, but I think not. After Dirty Harry, the movie theme becomes self evident. The heart drawn around John Ramsay on the business article shows a motive.

There is another recurrent theme of sacrifice which I have not yet explored. It has been mentioned as a parallel by Janet McReynold, that JonBenet was a scapegoat for the sins of the global village. Of course the movie: Dirty Harry has the cross in it. I am learning there are lots of "coincidences" because we talk and develop our ideas from a common language of symbols.

Could be the perp was just on drugs, envious, and was a pedophile to boot. Still most likely, I think the perp wanted to get revenge. The intricate set-up of the note, magazine, etc. makes me think it was more prepared.

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unregistered user
Apr-16-03, 10:44 PM (EST)
10. "The heart on the picture....."
In response to message #9
   LAST EDITED ON Apr-16-03 AT 10:46 PM (EST)
The newspaper articles about the "Night Strangler" were in the beginning of the movie. The article with the X's and the heart around Denzel's head was later in the movie...and although brief, the camera closed in on it.....it was in a box of stuff, Denzel's partner obtained from the prison----lots of articles Lithgow kept about Denzel, that showed his obsession, including a book on "How to Get Revenge."

Interesting at the end, was Lithgow freaking out, because he thought Denzel was going to kill himself---that wasn't in his plan--he wanted Denzel to live and go to prison.

The Texas guy sounds interesting...hadn't heard about that one before. I don't know if it was a true vendetta---or a game that got out of hand---ie: role-playing, and JR just happened to come to their attention. Remember in Leopold and Loeb---they had the idea---but not the target---Bobby Franks wasn't picked until the very day he was abducted, and just happened to walk past L&L while they were prowling around in their car. It wasn't personal to them.

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unregistered user
Apr-19-03, 06:59 PM (EST)
11. "RE: the Cross in both Movies"
In response to message #10
   Another thing I JUST realized was that the cross was shown very imposing in a major scene of Dirty Harry AND was also shown on the Cover Box of Ricochet. It seems too much of a coincidence. Maybe there is a connection here with SBTC (Saved By The Cross). Maybe the perp had a thing about crosses. The cross shown on the box cover of Ricochet is really prison cross bars. Could it be that the theme of Ricochet was interpreted by the perp as a crucifiction? I think this deserves some exploration.

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unregistered user
Apr-24-03, 01:16 AM (EST)
13. "RE: What about the son of someone"
In response to message #7
   The main objective and motive for this crime was to attack JonBenet Ramsey. IMO, it was a sexual, sadistic attacker. Everything beyond that is incidental. He may know her parents or he may not, but his attack on their daughter had nothing to do with them and everything to do with acting out fantasy material. Again, IMO, this person is completely absorbed in fantasy and self promotion and everything done in that house that night was done toward the satisfaction of these motives. This case has been in the public eye for years, now, and he has received a great amount of satisfaction from that. With the changing political scene in Boulder, it may only be a matter of time before he is arrested. Like Ted Bundy said, "Sometimes, I got lucky, and sometimes they got lucky." Maybe his luck is running out. I certainly hope so because he doesn't deserve all the rewards he gets from the media. He deserves to disappear from history like a tiny blip on a radar screen. He may believe that his crime has made him significant, but the only thing significant is JonBenet and her family. He would like to ride on their coat tails, but he hasn't got the stature.


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unregistered user
Apr-24-03, 00:21 AM (EST)
12. "RE: Thank you Terrance"
In response to message #3
   I agree with you that this guy wrote his own movie script. My guess is that he sees his whole life in terms of scripts and roles in which he casts himself in the starring role. I think he planned the crime for quite some time. It gave him quite a sense of power to leave the note. If he is still alive and has internet access, he probably reads this forum all the time getting quite a kick out of us all casting around in the dark. I agree that he is drawn to crime movies and pulled movie lines into his ransom note. It is certainly possible that he included the ransom amount and the S.B.T.C because these would have had meaning to JonBenet's, mother and father. Just another thing to further his own needs for power and feeling superior. The ransom note was written for himself mainly, but also to mislead the police and mother and father. IMO. He isn't as intelligent as he thinks he is, either. I think he has developed a surface sophistication and wants to leave a legacy of himself as a "gentleman" killer, but these kinds of cases are very difficult to solve. It was an organized crime scene in that he didn't panic and he took precautions not to leave behind too much evidence, but I believe he saw himself as so brilliant that he wrote the note in his own hand. Too bad he is really quite impotent mentally, emotionally and physically. If the Boulder police department hadn't imploded, there is the possibility that he would have been arrested by now because of sheer ineptitude.


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unregistered user
Apr-24-03, 07:42 PM (EST)
14. "RE: Thank you Terrance"
In response to message #12
   This is fascinating. I had no idea there were so many movie references in the staging of the murder.

There was also mention of the large cross in Dirty Harry and the one on the cover of the other movie. I thought it was interesting that the description of Jon Benets body when found was with her wrists tied and her arms over her head. This reminds me of many depictions of Christ on the cross, especially in the traditional Catholic faith.

A quick search of the garotte tells me that it was a device used in the past to quickly kill witches prior to a painful death by burning. I'm wondering if there isn't a psychological element that believed that he was somehow sacrificing Jon Benet for a greater good. Perhaps he had really convinced himself that John Ramsey was an evil man.

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