4 MR. WOOD: Ready to go?
5 MR. KANE: I am ready.
6 Q. (By Mr. Kane) Mrs. Ramsey, the
7 last question I asked you was, you had this
8 concern about Burke and this killer and the
9 potential that he could be harmed, and in
10 spite of concerns by your security people,
11 you had him transported to and from the
12 school by Susan Stein. Did Ms. Stein have
13 any kind of training in self-defense, to your
15 A. I don't know.
16 Q. Does she have any kind of
17 training in taking evasive maneuvers if
18 someone were to try to get into her car at
19 a stop sign or anything like that?
20 A. I don't know if she had any
21 formal training in that.
LOLOLOL Susan Stine is formidible - ask any tabloid reporter! John and Patsy knew she would defend Burke if needed - they trusted her and she didn't let them down.
Formal training really isn't always what counts - - it's heart that counts sometimes.
22 Q. Was there a discussion, when you
23 talked about security issues with either
24 Tracy Temple or with Ellis Armistead, were
25 you privy to discussions about the potential
1 for harm to come to Burke while being
2 transported to or from school?
3 A. No.
4 Q. And in your recollection, that
5 never came up as an issue? Is that what
6 you are saying?
7 A. No.
8 Q. No, it didn't come up or --
9 A. I was unaware if it ever came up.
10 Q. Okay. When I asked you about
11 what it was that you had in mind in setting
12 up a security system, I take it that you
13 thought somebody could come into the school
14 and do harm to Burke inside the school; is
15 that correct?
16 A. Correct.
17 Q. Okay. The --
18 A. That's inconclusive of media as
20 Q. Oh, okay. But was it more media
21 than the killer?
22 A. Well, it was all of those. You
23 know, the media would alert -- their presence
24 there would alert everyone that Burke was at
25 the school, so I wasn't crazy about them
1 hanging around the school. Of course, the
2 killer was still out there; although, we had
3 been advised that he probably would not, you
4 know, come out because now everybody is
5 alerted and looking for him.
6 You know, and then there is what
7 they call copy cat people, you know, who
8 want to get a piece of the publicity, and
9 they would be lurking around.
10 Q. And who was it who gave you this
11 advice that the killer would probably not
12 want to come back?
13 A. John Douglas.
14 Q. Okay. And did Mr. Douglas tell
15 you that -- or what did he tell you?
16 A. Well, he said we had to be aware
17 of three situations. One, obviously the
18 killer was at large; two, what you call a
19 copy cat killer, somebody that says, oh, that
20 looks like an interesting idea, I think I
21 will try to do the same thing; and, three,
22 what he termed vigilante perpetrators or
23 whatever term you want to use for them. You
24 know, somebody that says, oh, you know, the
25 police aren't taking care of this, I will
1 take care of it.
2 In other words, just alerting us
3 that there are a lot of crazy people out
5 Q. And the first, so the first
6 concern he said was that it was probably
7 unlikely that the killer would come back, the
8 person that perpetrated the crime; is that
9 what he said?
10 A. He said it was very unlikely.
11 Q. Okay. But how about the copy cat
12 killer, what kind of opinion did he offer
13 about the potential for that?
14 A. He said it was very great.
15 Q. And this would be somebody who
16 would try to pattern what had already
17 happened to JonBenet, to do the same thing
18 to Burke?
19 A. Uh-huh (affirmative). Right.
20 MR. LEVIN: Can I interrupt you
21 just a second, Mike? I am sorry.
22 MR. KANE: Yes.
23 Q. (By Mr. Levin) Mrs. Ramsey, as I
24 understand it, at this point in time, which
25 would be early 1997, your belief was that
1 the murder of your daughter was an act of
2 retaliation for some unknown reason towards
3 either you or your husband?
4 A. Right.
5 Q. You no longer hold that belief;
7 A. Not necessarily.
8 Q. I was under the impression that,
9 in your book, you stated you thought it was
10 a pedophile.
11 A. Well, it could be one in the
13 Q. I see.
14 MR. LEVIN: Thank you, ma'am.
What? How is that going to help identify the killer? Come ON, K&C - shart talking suspects, for crying out loud!
15 Q. (By Mr. Kane) In the third, the
16 vigilante, what was Mr. Douglas' opinion
17 about the probability or possibility about
18 somebody feeling that the authorities weren't
19 getting to the bottom of this so that they
20 would do harm?
21 A. Uh-huh (indicating affirmatively).
22 Q. What was his opinion about how
23 strong of a threat that was?
24 A. He just thought it was very
25 strong because, in his years of experience,
1 there are lots of those kinds of strange
2 people out there.
3 Q. Did he talk to you about where
4 your copy cat killer or vigilante might
5 strike and where you should be careful?
6 A. No.
7 Q. But you thought that school was
8 certainly one of the places that a person
9 could come in?
10 A. Well, since that's where Burke
11 spent the greatest part of his day.
12 Q. Okay.
13 A. You know, I'm the mother of a
14 murdered child. I was fearful, just fearful
15 of everything. Most particularly about my
16 child, my husband, and myself.
17 Q. Okay. And, I mean, did you have
18 discussions either with Mr. Douglas or with
19 Ellis Armistead or any of the other security
20 people that you had, had you had discussions
21 with them about how somebody might pose a
22 threat to Burke while he was in school?
23 A. Not specifically.
24 Q. Did you have any kind of security
25 on Burke outside of school?
1 A. Well, he was with us all the
2 time. You know, he was pretty much in a
3 protected environment other than the time he
4 was in school.
I think most of us feel we can protect out kids ourselves - or we trust other adults can (teachers and the like.) Especially if we know we are being vigilant.
What is K&C saying would have been the proper response to this murder - - for them to pull Burke out of school to homeschool him with armed guards stationed at every door?
The killer had his chance to take Burke and didn't. There was little reason to think Burke was a target.