Q. You have told me about what you have described and we'll leave it to your description on the
record, your feelings about Alex Hunter. You're aware of, I think, Alex Hunter's feelings of you and
descriptions of you as somebody out for blood money, a rogue detective, we'll leave it at that, and
maybe others. You're aware of those things being said publicly by Mr. Hunter about you?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. When did the -- I mean, there is a level of animosity between the two of you and that's probably
politely stated; wouldn't you agree?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. When did that start? Did it exist before the Ramsey case?

A. I didn't know Hunter before the Ramsey case.

Q. When in the scale of things do you think you can say to yourself that you formulated opinions that
you hold about Alex Hunter? And you don't have to answer for him I'll ask him at the appropriate
time. I want to know when you felt like you were sitting there thinking I can't believe a word this man
speaks?

A. Mr. Wood, that was a -- certainly there was a culture inside the police department that existed
years or a couple of decades before I even arrived there in which the DA's office and the police
department had a terrible working relationship. But not knowing Mr. Hunter until our involvement on
this case together, that was very incremental in fashion or incremental in stages, but by the time I left
the police department, it was certainly at its height. I was very dismayed and disappointed and had no
love for Hunter after some of these revelations by Shapiro.